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	<title>Comments on: DON’T SAVE THE PLANET</title>
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	<link>http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/</link>
	<description>Charting the disconnect between climate science and action</description>
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		<title>By: Joanna Hansell</title>
		<link>http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/comment-page-1/#comment-37106</link>
		<dc:creator>Joanna Hansell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 22:59:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/#comment-37106</guid>
		<description>George this is a very interesting point of view.  I recently did a study on whether the current tax incentives encourage businesses to go green.  Although it confirmed current government incentives don&#039;t encourage people or businesses to change their behaviour, my findings did show that people beleive government and legislation are a key role.  I never thought of it from a phsycological point of view.  I think you are right, I agree we do need to move away from this idea of scaring people into doing something they wouldn&#039;t want to do.  I&#039;m not sure if the wording &#039;light living&#039; is quite right but I do like your theory.  We need to find a way of reaching out to people at a personal level, to explain how it&#039;s understandable to think that our behaviour isn&#039;t having an effect on the environment we live in, to then actually point out the immediate effects it has on individuals (fumes, skin damage, cost, ways of saving money etc) and then go on to demonstrate how simple things which are just a matter of becoming a habit and a slight change in life style can make all the a huge difference if everyone did the same.  I feel there is not enough public awareness.  People need to be informed and educated about the subject.  Like you said this needs to be at a lower level that we can relate too rather then a huge scale like &quot;the planet&quot; that just seems over whelming.
I don&#039;t think it is a case of people not caring or not wanting to make a change.  I think it is a case of this issue not being a priority over daily routin such as working, prviding for the family, finding time for your children etc. When you don&#039;t see the immediate effect of your actions then why should there be a need to think about it unless it is being taken sersiously by others for example government taking action.  At present this isn&#039;t happening so we need to keep reminding people of the simple changes that can easily be made around everyday life, and keep reminding people. If you don&#039;t use it you lose,it&#039;s hard to change old habits.  I think it is government that should be &quot;scared&quot; into change as they can relate to it at larger scale.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>George this is a very interesting point of view.  I recently did a study on whether the current tax incentives encourage businesses to go green.  Although it confirmed current government incentives don&#8217;t encourage people or businesses to change their behaviour, my findings did show that people beleive government and legislation are a key role.  I never thought of it from a phsycological point of view.  I think you are right, I agree we do need to move away from this idea of scaring people into doing something they wouldn&#8217;t want to do.  I&#8217;m not sure if the wording &#8216;light living&#8217; is quite right but I do like your theory.  We need to find a way of reaching out to people at a personal level, to explain how it&#8217;s understandable to think that our behaviour isn&#8217;t having an effect on the environment we live in, to then actually point out the immediate effects it has on individuals (fumes, skin damage, cost, ways of saving money etc) and then go on to demonstrate how simple things which are just a matter of becoming a habit and a slight change in life style can make all the a huge difference if everyone did the same.  I feel there is not enough public awareness.  People need to be informed and educated about the subject.  Like you said this needs to be at a lower level that we can relate too rather then a huge scale like &#8220;the planet&#8221; that just seems over whelming.<br />
I don&#8217;t think it is a case of people not caring or not wanting to make a change.  I think it is a case of this issue not being a priority over daily routin such as working, prviding for the family, finding time for your children etc. When you don&#8217;t see the immediate effect of your actions then why should there be a need to think about it unless it is being taken sersiously by others for example government taking action.  At present this isn&#8217;t happening so we need to keep reminding people of the simple changes that can easily be made around everyday life, and keep reminding people. If you don&#8217;t use it you lose,it&#8217;s hard to change old habits.  I think it is government that should be &#8220;scared&#8221; into change as they can relate to it at larger scale.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Brown</title>
		<link>http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/comment-page-1/#comment-36306</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Brown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 21:18:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/#comment-36306</guid>
		<description>Lets explore the psychology of those who are in denial about climate change being too far past the tipping point to stop it!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lets explore the psychology of those who are in denial about climate change being too far past the tipping point to stop it!</p>
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		<title>By: Garrett Jones</title>
		<link>http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/comment-page-1/#comment-30150</link>
		<dc:creator>Garrett Jones</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Aug 2008 10:53:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/#comment-30150</guid>
		<description>Sorry, there was an error in the URL just submitted. Comment 14 should be: 


If you look at my website: http://www.garrettjones.talktalk.net
you will find two books which can both be had for free and which both have a lot to do with the kind of practical steps we can take to improve our global situation - if only our outworn ideas and prejudices can be overcome</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, there was an error in the URL just submitted. Comment 14 should be: </p>
<p>If you look at my website: <a href="http://www.garrettjones.talktalk.net" rel="nofollow">http://www.garrettjones.talktalk.net</a><br />
you will find two books which can both be had for free and which both have a lot to do with the kind of practical steps we can take to improve our global situation &#8211; if only our outworn ideas and prejudices can be overcome</p>
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		<title>By: Paul</title>
		<link>http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/comment-page-1/#comment-18302</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Feb 2008 23:46:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/#comment-18302</guid>
		<description>I like this article.  You&#039;re getting to the point (in my humble opinion).  I&#039;m opposed to the &#039;save the planet&#039; message too.  The main reason for that is I don&#039;t think the planet needs saving. It&#039;s us.

It is us humans that need to think about our future - because there are six billion plus of us and we all want to have 4x4 cars and flush toilets, when many of us don&#039;t have food and water at the moment.  It is self-evident that if we all have some of the pie then our current use of resources is unsustainable and damaging.

Someone who really troubles me is Mr Gaia himself, Mr Lovelock.  He has taken the credit for what we now know to be obvious, that the planet regulates itself over longer and shorter cycles.  The environmental message was getting through (slowly), consumers were opposed to genetic engineering, nuclear power was dead and sustainable logging was becoming more popular (even if the other type of logging was too).  Rivers were being cleaned up.  Wind farms were springing up everywhere and there was a proper debate as to whether they were a good thing or not.

Then a few hot summers and it&#039;s panic!  Outright panic!  It&#039;s too late says Mr. Lovelock.  We are all doomed! Stop all debate!  We MUST have nuclear power NOW.  We must tear up the forests and plant millions of acres of monocultural biofuels.  

Now we ARE heading for disaster!  Thank you Mr. Lovelock and all those who want to &#039;save the planet&#039; from imminent doom.  Great work.  In our haste, we will make the wrong decisions as we always do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like this article.  You&#8217;re getting to the point (in my humble opinion).  I&#8217;m opposed to the &#8217;save the planet&#8217; message too.  The main reason for that is I don&#8217;t think the planet needs saving. It&#8217;s us.</p>
<p>It is us humans that need to think about our future &#8211; because there are six billion plus of us and we all want to have 4&#215;4 cars and flush toilets, when many of us don&#8217;t have food and water at the moment.  It is self-evident that if we all have some of the pie then our current use of resources is unsustainable and damaging.</p>
<p>Someone who really troubles me is Mr Gaia himself, Mr Lovelock.  He has taken the credit for what we now know to be obvious, that the planet regulates itself over longer and shorter cycles.  The environmental message was getting through (slowly), consumers were opposed to genetic engineering, nuclear power was dead and sustainable logging was becoming more popular (even if the other type of logging was too).  Rivers were being cleaned up.  Wind farms were springing up everywhere and there was a proper debate as to whether they were a good thing or not.</p>
<p>Then a few hot summers and it&#8217;s panic!  Outright panic!  It&#8217;s too late says Mr. Lovelock.  We are all doomed! Stop all debate!  We MUST have nuclear power NOW.  We must tear up the forests and plant millions of acres of monocultural biofuels.  </p>
<p>Now we ARE heading for disaster!  Thank you Mr. Lovelock and all those who want to &#8217;save the planet&#8217; from imminent doom.  Great work.  In our haste, we will make the wrong decisions as we always do.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Gardner</title>
		<link>http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/comment-page-1/#comment-16175</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Gardner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Dec 2007 20:50:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/#comment-16175</guid>
		<description>I appreciate the intentions here, but worry this notion amounts to &quot;dumbing down&quot; the message for all the American Idol watchers out there. Who are we to say they can&#039;t handle the truth? The more we give in to this notion that the people need a cheesy slogan and can&#039;t handle bad news (the truth), the more we lose. It is a self-fulfilling prophecy, and we&#039;ll get the deck chairs on the Titanic rearranged nicely this way, but the ship won&#039;t stop or turn based on a candy-coated, good-news-only approach. For example, do you really think we can achieve global sustainability if everyone lives light, but we continue to worship economic growth and incentivize (or at least ignore) population growth?

I believe this further splinters the environmental movement and weakens it. Personally, I think I&#039;d rather go down shouting &quot;full stop&quot; at the ship&#039;s captain, rather than go down singing a cheery song and being thrilled we hit the iceberg at half-speed, but at least everyone bought into the notion we should slow down.

Dave Gardner
Producer/Director
Hooked on Growth: Our Misguided Quest for Prosperity
www.growthbusters.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I appreciate the intentions here, but worry this notion amounts to &#8220;dumbing down&#8221; the message for all the American Idol watchers out there. Who are we to say they can&#8217;t handle the truth? The more we give in to this notion that the people need a cheesy slogan and can&#8217;t handle bad news (the truth), the more we lose. It is a self-fulfilling prophecy, and we&#8217;ll get the deck chairs on the Titanic rearranged nicely this way, but the ship won&#8217;t stop or turn based on a candy-coated, good-news-only approach. For example, do you really think we can achieve global sustainability if everyone lives light, but we continue to worship economic growth and incentivize (or at least ignore) population growth?</p>
<p>I believe this further splinters the environmental movement and weakens it. Personally, I think I&#8217;d rather go down shouting &#8220;full stop&#8221; at the ship&#8217;s captain, rather than go down singing a cheery song and being thrilled we hit the iceberg at half-speed, but at least everyone bought into the notion we should slow down.</p>
<p>Dave Gardner<br />
Producer/Director<br />
Hooked on Growth: Our Misguided Quest for Prosperity<br />
<a href="http://www.growthbusters.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.growthbusters.com</a></p>
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		<title>By: adriene</title>
		<link>http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/comment-page-1/#comment-16114</link>
		<dc:creator>adriene</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Dec 2007 16:51:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/#comment-16114</guid>
		<description>tamara, 

i am not sure about your claim that handwashing dishes instead of using the dishwasher would shave 20 bucks off the water bill. 

it depends on how efficient you are with water while you are hand washing, and also on how efficient the dish washer is with water and electricity, plus the value of the time it saves you. 

the latest models of dishwasher here in japan claim to use a lot less water than hand washing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>tamara, </p>
<p>i am not sure about your claim that handwashing dishes instead of using the dishwasher would shave 20 bucks off the water bill. </p>
<p>it depends on how efficient you are with water while you are hand washing, and also on how efficient the dish washer is with water and electricity, plus the value of the time it saves you. </p>
<p>the latest models of dishwasher here in japan claim to use a lot less water than hand washing.</p>
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		<title>By: Sepand</title>
		<link>http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/comment-page-1/#comment-15275</link>
		<dc:creator>Sepand</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Dec 2007 14:39:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/#comment-15275</guid>
		<description>Cool article, but the ending is vague. All that stuff to get to &quot;light living,&quot; yet what the hell do you mean by that phrase? How can you introduce that phrase without specifying its meaning? I&#039;m confused, and mad!

[George writes: Light living. I go into this in Carbon Detox but hoped it would still be fairly obvious. We talk all the time about low-carbon living and sustainable living and ethical living. I wanted to find a new way of presenting it that had wider appeal and I thought that living &#039;light&#039; sounded much better- free of that heavy carbon, that consumerist stress, fresh, healthy. You get my drift. Btw in England &#039;mad&#039; means insane but I assume you mean that you are slightly heated! ]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cool article, but the ending is vague. All that stuff to get to &#8220;light living,&#8221; yet what the hell do you mean by that phrase? How can you introduce that phrase without specifying its meaning? I&#8217;m confused, and mad!</p>
<p>[George writes: Light living. I go into this in Carbon Detox but hoped it would still be fairly obvious. We talk all the time about low-carbon living and sustainable living and ethical living. I wanted to find a new way of presenting it that had wider appeal and I thought that living 'light' sounded much better- free of that heavy carbon, that consumerist stress, fresh, healthy. You get my drift. Btw in England 'mad' means insane but I assume you mean that you are slightly heated! ]</p>
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		<title>By: Tamara Griesel</title>
		<link>http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/comment-page-1/#comment-15145</link>
		<dc:creator>Tamara Griesel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Nov 2007 17:42:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/#comment-15145</guid>
		<description>I agree that we should clear that large scale changes are good for us as well as for the big picture.  It helps, I think, that many people are unhappy in their current lifestyles.  Commuting an hour or more each way to get to work, and often as long to do errands is an aggravating, unhealthy waste of time even if carbon emissions weren&#039;t upsetting the climate.  Ride the subway or bus and read a book!  Bike or walk to work and save the cost and feeling of silliness associated with driving half an hour to the gym so you can run nowhere for half an hour.

Also, speaking from the point of view of the economically struggling, many people don&#039;t realize the cost of their invisible power use.  Poorer people could benefit greatly from knowing they could save 20 or more dollars a month by handwashing their dishes (most low income housing does boast dishwashers).  20 bucks may not seem like much to people with spare income, but I can tell you from personal experience, it can be the difference between feeding my kids Ramen noodles and being able to provide locally grown apples, pears, winter squash, sweet potatoes, and broccoli on a regular basis.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree that we should clear that large scale changes are good for us as well as for the big picture.  It helps, I think, that many people are unhappy in their current lifestyles.  Commuting an hour or more each way to get to work, and often as long to do errands is an aggravating, unhealthy waste of time even if carbon emissions weren&#8217;t upsetting the climate.  Ride the subway or bus and read a book!  Bike or walk to work and save the cost and feeling of silliness associated with driving half an hour to the gym so you can run nowhere for half an hour.</p>
<p>Also, speaking from the point of view of the economically struggling, many people don&#8217;t realize the cost of their invisible power use.  Poorer people could benefit greatly from knowing they could save 20 or more dollars a month by handwashing their dishes (most low income housing does boast dishwashers).  20 bucks may not seem like much to people with spare income, but I can tell you from personal experience, it can be the difference between feeding my kids Ramen noodles and being able to provide locally grown apples, pears, winter squash, sweet potatoes, and broccoli on a regular basis.</p>
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		<title>By: Dano</title>
		<link>http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/comment-page-1/#comment-15078</link>
		<dc:creator>Dano</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Nov 2007 03:53:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/#comment-15078</guid>
		<description>We&#039;re not going to destroy the planet through our activities. We may make it inhospitable for our species and may kill off enough species to be considered the sixth great extinction event, but destroy the planet? No. 

I suspect most folk intuitively know this, too, making the argument seem ridiculous. 

Best,

D</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We&#8217;re not going to destroy the planet through our activities. We may make it inhospitable for our species and may kill off enough species to be considered the sixth great extinction event, but destroy the planet? No. </p>
<p>I suspect most folk intuitively know this, too, making the argument seem ridiculous. </p>
<p>Best,</p>
<p>D</p>
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		<title>By: David Alexander</title>
		<link>http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/comment-page-1/#comment-15074</link>
		<dc:creator>David Alexander</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Nov 2007 00:46:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climatedenial.org/2007/11/23/don%e2%80%99t-save-the-planet/#comment-15074</guid>
		<description>It is thought-provoking.  I agree that ONLY the stick does not work, but maybe carrot-and-stick works best.  For example, &quot;you can choose either to live in a burned out wasteland with starvation all around, or in a pure, clean, respectful way that enjoys all the benefits of nature&quot;.  Contract between choices can be a motivator.  Just showing the positive by itself may not be as strong as showing that it is EITHER (fill in here - the positive) or else THIS (fill in here - the negative)!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is thought-provoking.  I agree that ONLY the stick does not work, but maybe carrot-and-stick works best.  For example, &#8220;you can choose either to live in a burned out wasteland with starvation all around, or in a pure, clean, respectful way that enjoys all the benefits of nature&#8221;.  Contract between choices can be a motivator.  Just showing the positive by itself may not be as strong as showing that it is EITHER (fill in here &#8211; the positive) or else THIS (fill in here &#8211; the negative)!</p>
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